A "floating pressure drop" type flowbench - By David Vizard

[AceR]

Ah.................. yes Tony, that made perfect sense.........

[Brucepts]

Garage Journal is an example, 3 posts advertising this site, then no more.Those posts were purely designed to funnel people here. Even those old farts called you a spammer. That is a case of self promotion as well .. But hey, as I said before I don't have a problem with that.

My post on Garage Journal was simply a helping post for those guys, it was on topic and followed along with others who self promoted also! I figured out they were a bunch of a-holes and left that forum never to return! Nobody wanted to discuss anything just attack me for being a spammer there.

I asked for my post to be deleted and they would not delete it so what was I to do. Yep never to return to that forum! Post is still there? Imagine that it must have been on topic for the owner/moderator of that site? Members calling SPAM really doesn't matter but on that forum it's an art form I found! See self driven posts like that are what drives traffic to sites! If you notice there is also a link here somewhere back to that forum so it's a two way street for those of us who run forums!

Back links are what gets you higher search ranking and forum owners love that, else my post would have been deleted if no back-link to their forum from mine existed.

My forums existed way before my parts sales, my parts sales were driven by forum members telling me to start selling parts. Personally it was a moral dilemma to start selling parts and self promotion as it went against my core value of what I was doing with the forum! But, it costs me to run this forum and website so what to do? Yep sell parts to pay the bills so everyone could still get free info.

I could give a rats ass if anyone buys my parts! (I do need to pay bills though) You can build a flowbench on your own if you do the research on these two forums and never use one of my parts. I wave no magical wand for the flowbench DIY'er. I simply am supplying parts that some might not be able to build or want to build.

Those guys who have been here for years know what I went through to finally design a set of plans to sell, they know the talks I had about "self promotion" on those plans. It was only after me getting tired of people coming here getting free info and then starting up their own company to sell parts and plans and then people coming here to ask for help on why that shit did not work????

The old forum is full of posts on those designs people paid money for that were ripped off from this forum! I helped my competitor design his flow elements! I have all the original emails of our talks, guess what he patented it! Now sells it for big bucks and guess what people call me for support as they can not support their own product. It uses a shop-vac and sells for $1000??? Give me a break!! How bout the other guy selling plans/parts ripped off from the MSD style flowbench, yep lots of posts in the old forum about how well that deign works? Look at what they charge and what I charge for my parts? Yep self promotion on my part is making me a rich man! So rich I had to ask for donations last month (btw thanks to the 3 guys who donated it was much appreciated)

I ripped most of my designs from my own forum, I asked everyone who might have had an idea I used for permission before I used it in one of my designs. I did not go to someone else's forum garner knowledge and then start my own business. My forum was never started so I could build and sell parts, it evolved to this point and here I am, yep somedays I still wrestle with that moral dilemma of selling parts and my goal for this forum. Do you see big ads for my parts plastered all over my forum? I do not need to advertise my parts, my parts speak for themselves and everyone who is happy with my parts promotes for me

Wow sorry I was on a roll . . . please do not take my post personally as you were just the catalyst for me to get going, it's been one hell of a week here on the forum and flowbench related phone calls and I needed to vent!

Now back to flowbench discussion I had my yearly rant!

[Flash]

I have bought part to help with this forum, but never donated to it.

The help from Bruce and Other on this forum is the ONLY REASON my pour excuse for a flow bench, was ever, EVER MADE USABLE. And it works DAM good now!

Even though i bought Bruce plan, i Did Not fallow them and it caused a Lot of greaf to me as well as many of the member, that NEVER GRUMBLED, but just keep helping and pushing to fix the faults in the bench.

Yes I'm one of the 3 that donate to the forum, in Bruce's time of need, and my donation.........Imvestment HAD a return of 1000 TIMES, BEFORE I DONATED!

[AceR]

No problem Bruce, it's all good. I just wanted to get all the issues out of the way first. Which we have..

[1960FL]

ACeR,

To me it's usually just sour grapes of some sort..

LOL, That i do not have! I need not be successful in the public domain nor self promote to feel better abut myself or financially successful. I had only an affiliation with this form as a member in the beginning I chose to help Bruce with the Digital manometer project and we became Friends I gain no financial reward from this site I like the people and keep contributing.

You are good with the keyboard same as the last 2 touting DV on this thread, I'm not reaching or implying in my posts, Build the thing, post the data, and make it stick, and the rest of us will give you props until then you are just another blank stare follower of DV. Keep posting, contribute to the forum and lets see your work! unlike the last couple who come stir the pot and leave. Here ACE, is your opportunity to contribute to the forum and Flowbenching Become the GURU of Variable depression others here have chosen their topic just started off on a different foot. If all you are looking for is the answers to a quick easy cheep florbench then see blelow, me i look forward to your contributions to the forum with less criticism.

Here is the recipe for a FREE flowbench and the answer to every question is right here on the forum. Ad nauseam!

Source of depression
mechanism to very depression
settling box
mechanism to measure airflow
settling box
test fixture

Rick

O'h and i do suggest reading Taylor, Obert and Lichty they are staple unless for fun you have a sterling book 4th edition from 1917.

[jfholm]

My 2¢ - We all know that a running engine does not have the same depression or suck through the running cycle. So the floating depression idea makes sense until you really stop and think about it. I played with floating depression when I was using the Flowquik. Just crank it to full suck and adjust your valve opening - It would automatically calculate to 28" but would show you the actual depression at each valve lift. I thought "COOL"! With one vacuum cleaner at .050" lift it would be like 39" H2O and by the time I got to .600" + lift it would be 6" H2O or so. I thought I would then add another vacuum cleaner. Then my actual depression was even higher which made me stop and think "What is the actual depression in your engine?

After researching there are so many things that change the actual depression in an engine you could not actually track it unless you had bottomless pockets like somebody on Penske's level has. That is definitely not me.

Through my experiences I came to this forum and decided to give it a try. I have been doing heads for years and give the sharp edge orifice bench my full endorsement. I had lost my access to a good bench and needed to get one but there is no way I can afford the $15,000 for a commercial bench. I have built one from Bruce's plans and have never regretted it. With the other attempts I was doing I spent all my time trying to keep the darn things calibrated and working. This Bench I built from this forum I can walk away from for months and come back and it is still right on. That is what I have wanted.

Does DV offer good information, sure, on a lot of things but I do not put my eggs in one basket. Larry Meaux at his forum is very open with his knowledge and it is up to date, not something that happened in 1980. I have also bought Darin Morgans CD from Speedtalk and it is great. Also Harold Bettes CD and Book. These are great sources and I refer to them all the time. I have DV book but I am afraid I do not use it anymore because I feel the other sources I mentioned are more advanced and up to date. I have also tried what they have suggested and it works.

I hope this helps. I have been the way for floating depression but cannot figure out what the point would be. If somebody knows what the real depression in an engine is they are not sharing it readily and I know that it is much higher than I can duplicate anyway and varies with RPM throttle opening etc. This makes it way too complicated to try and replicate on my level. Besides that all the major head porters are still using non-floating depression benches.

John

[AceR]

1960FL, if you don't stop scratching this DV thing you have it will never get better. Until then I don't think we have anything to discuss.
In am simply doing this as an experiment not because DV is cutting me a cheque or I want to hang at his shop.. If it fails, then it fails. If it works then it works. Will it have limitations?, will it be good enough for a one time porter at home with a drill and a bunch of sanding rolls?
As I said lets not loose sight at who this type of bench is aimed at and what sort of heads it was first used on.

[Tony]

In am simply doing this as an experiment

Fine, we have all gone through that stage ourselves.

Messing about with air can certainly be fun, but eventually you will either completely give up, or you may start listening to advice from some of the people here that have already built themselves a very successful flow bench.

[Brucepts]

I agree, people come here talking about a "floating depression flowbench" after getting all excited reading about it but, I have yet to see one actually working??

So far it's just been discussion we have yet to see one working. I have not even seen one working that V built??

I say build one and report back with pics and actual test results and make us a believer of the theory

[AceR]

Ok, will report back here when working. I've got an "A" series head here. I'll start with that.